Chesed Club World Wide Center & Discussion Groups


Menachos 89 - OIL FOR


(a) (Mishnah): A half-Log of oil is used for Todah.
(b) (Beraisa - R. Akiva) Question: (It says "Chalos Matzos Belulos ba'Shemen u'Rekikei Matzos Meshuchim ba'Shamen) - why must it say 'Shemen' twice?
1. Answer: If it only said 'Shemen' once, we would have thought that these are like all other Menachos, they have one Log of oil;
i. Therefore, it says 'Shemen' twice, two Ribuyim (inclusions) to include the same thing really come to exclude, we deduct half a Log, only a half-Log is used.
2. Question: This is not two Ribuyim (one is needed to teach that oil is used!)
3. Answer: Had it not said 'Shemen' at all, we would have said that one Log is used, like other Menachos - therefore, the two words 'Shemen' are two Ribuyim.
4. Suggestion: Perhaps the half-Log is evenly divided among the three kinds of Matzah (the verse ends, "V'Soles Murbeches Belulos ba'Shamen")!
5. Rejection: There was no need to mention oil regarding Revuchah (we would have learned from Chavitim, which are also called Revuchah and have oil);
i. It is mentioned to teach that it has more oil, i.e. half of the half-Log is for the Revuchah, the other half (of the half-Log) is for the Chalos and Rekikim.
6. R. Elazar ben Azaryah: I do not accept your Drashos - rather, a tradition from Sinai teaches a half-Log for Lachmei Todah (R. Gershom - that it is split equally among the three kinds of Matzah), a quarter-Log for Lachmei Nazir, and 11 days (of Zivah) that separate between Nidos (i.e. days on which any blood seen is Dam Nidah.)
(a) (Mishnah): The Log was used for Menachos.
(b) (Beraisa - Chachamim): Regarding a poor Metzora it says "V'Isaron...Balul...v'Log" - this teaches that each Isaron (of Soles) requires a Log (of oil);
(c) R. Nechemyah and R. Eliezer say, only one Log is used, even for a Minchah of 60 Esronim - "L'Minchah v'Log Shamen".
(d) Question: How do R. Nechemyah and R. Eliezer expound "V'Isaron...Balul...v'Log"?
(e) Answer: This teaches that the Oni must bring an Isaron (with a Log of oil.)
1. Chachamim say, we already know that - since a rich person brings three Zevachim and three Esronim, surely an Oni, who bring one Zevach, brings one Isaron!
2. They answer, since the Torah is lenient on the Oni, one might have thought that he does not bring a Minchah at all!
3. Chachamim say, we never find a Zevach (except for Bechor, Ma'aser and Pesach, which never have Nesachim) brought without Nesachim.
(f) Question: How do Chachamim expound "L'Minchah v'Log Shamen"?
(g) Answer: This teaches that one who volunteers to bring a Minchah must bring at least the amount of Soles that requires a Log of oil, i.e. an Isaron.
(h) R. Nechemyah and R. Eliezer also learn this from the verse (in addition to learning that one Log is used even for a big Minchah.)
(i) (Mishnah): Six Lugim are for a bull, four for a ram, three for a lamb.
(j) Question: What is the source for this?
(k) Answer: "V'Niskeihem Chetzi ha'Hin Yihyeh la'Par...";
1. We know that a Hin is 12 Lugim from "Shemen Mishchas Kodesh Yihyeh Zeh Li" - the Gematri'a of "Zeh" is 12.
(a) (Mishnah): Three and a half Lugim were used for the Menorah, half a Log for each lamp.
(b) Question: What is the source of this?
(c) Answer (Beraisa): "Me'Erev Ad Boker" - we put enough oil in to burn from evening until morning;
1. This also teaches that Hadlakas ha'Menorah is the only Avodah that applies all night.
2. Chachamim estimated that a half-Log suffices (for the longest nights, i.e. in winter.)
(d) Opinion #1: They estimated from above (first they used more than a half-Log - when they saw that it was too much, they successively used less until they found the right Shi'ur);
(e) Opinion #2: They estimated from below (first they used less, they successively used more until they found the right Shi'ur).
(f) Opinion #2 says that they started putting too little - the Torah is concerned for money of Yisrael (extra oil put inside cannot be salvaged);
(g) Opinion #1 says that they started putting too much - we do not conduct like paupers in the place of wealth (the Mikdash.)
(a) (Mishnah): The following Nesachim may be mixed with each other:
1. Nesachim of bulls with Nesachim of rams (these have the same consistency, two Lugim of oil per Isaron of Soles);
2. Nesachim of lambs with each other, Nesachim of Korbanos Yachid with those of Korbanos Tzibur, Nesachim of today with those of yesterday;

(b) We may not mix Nesachim of lambs (which have three Lugim of oil for one Isaron) with those of bulls or rams;
1. If each Nesech was Balul (mixed with oil) by itself, and then the Nesachim became mixed, they are Kesherim;
2. If the Nesachim became mixed before Blilah, they are Pesulim.
(c) The Minchah of the lamb brought with the Omer is (two Esronim,) twice the usual Minchas Nesachim for a lamb, but its Nesech (of wine) is the usual size (three Lugim.)
(d) (Gemara) Contradiction (Beraisa): "V'Hiktir*o*" - we may not mix the Chelev of different animals together. (Our Mishnah permits mixing Nesachim of bulls and rams!)
(e) Answer #1 (R. Yochanan): The Mishnah teaches that b'Diavad, if the Nesachim were mixed, they are Kesherim.
(f) Question: If so, when the Mishnah forbids mixing Nesachim of lambs with those of bulls, we must say that even b'Diavad, they are Pesulim;
1. But the Seifa says, if each Nesech was Balul by itself and then they were mixed, they are Kesherim; implying that in the Reisha they may be mixed l'Chatchilah!
(g) Answer (Abaye): R. Yochanan means, if the Menachos became mixed, the Nesachim *of wine* may be mixed.
(h) Objection: This implies that (if the Menachos were not mixed) the wines may not be mixed - a Beraisa contradicts this!
1. (Beraisa): This refers to Menachos (of Nesachim), but the wines may be mixed.
(i) Answer #2 (Abaye): After Haktaras ha'Menachos, l'Chatchilah we may mix the wines (Rashi Kesav Yad - no matter which animals they are for; Rambam - only if the accompanying Menachos have the same consistency);
1. Before Haktarah - if Menachos (of the same consistency) became mixed, the corresponding wines may be mixed;
2. If the Menachos were not mixed, the wines may not be mixed - this is a
decree, lest one will mix the Menachos.
(a) (Mishnah): The Minchah of the lamb brought with the Omer...
(b) (Beraisa): "U'Minchaso Shnei Esronim" - this teaches that the Minchah of the lamb brought with the Omer is twice the usual Minchas Nesachim for a lamb;
1. Suggestion: Perhaps also the wine is double the usual amount!
2. Rejection: "V'Nisko Yayin Revi'is ha'Hin".
3. Suggestion: Perhaps the wine is not double, for it is not mixed with the Minchah, but oil is mixed with the Minchah, it is also double!
4. Rejection: "V'Nisko" - every liquid for its Nesachim is a Revi'is.
5. Question: How do we learn this from the verse?
6. Answer (R. Elazar): It is written "V'Niskah" (its (feminine) Nesech, i.e. (oil) of the Minchah), we read it "V'Nisko" (its (masculine) Nesech, i.e. (wine) of the lamb) - this equates the oil to the wine, it is also a Revi'is.
(c) (R. Yochanan): If Asham Metzora was slaughtered Lo Lishmah, it requires Nesachim;
1. If it would not have Nesachim, it would be Pasul.
(d) Questions (Rav Menasiya bar Gada): If so, if the lamb brought with the Omer was slaughtered Lo Lishmah, it should likewise require a double Minchah (as if it was Lishmah), if not it should be Pasul;
1. If the morning Tamid was slaughtered Lo Lishmah, we should need to have one Kohen bring two logs for the Ma'arachah with it (as if it was Lishmah), if not it should be Pasul! (Likewise, for the afternoon Tamid, two Kohanim must bring two logs.)
(e) Answer #1 (Abaye): Indeed, that is true - R. Yochanan did not teach about Asham Metzora to exclude those, he merely taught one example.