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08-24-2011
Title:
Chulin 67 - THE SOURCES FOR PERMITING FISH WITHOUT

Message:
1) THE SOURCES FOR PERMITING FISH WITHOUT "SIMANIM"

(a) Question: Which source to permit fish (in vessels) without Simanim is called explicit, which is not?
(b) Answer #1 (Rav Acha or Ravina): "You may eat (...what has the Simanim)" is the explicit source; "(What lacks the Simanim...) You may not eat" is not explicit.
1. The former is explicit, for it says "Those you may eat" right after "in seas and rivers";
2. The latter is not explicit, for "You may not eat" is not written adjacent to "in seas and rivers".
(c) Answer #2 (The other of Rav Acha and Ravina): "You may eat" is not explicit; "You may not eat" is explicit.
1. The former is not explicit, for it could have been understood to mean that all fish in vessels are forbidden;
2. The latter is explicit, for it surely permits all fish in vessels (and shows that the former verse also does.)
2) CREATURES THAT NEVER LEFT THEIR PLACE
(a) (Rav Huna): One should not strain (date) beer through a wooden strainer at night, lest a worm alight on the strainer and fall into the cup;
1. Since the worm (once) separated from the beer, it is considered "A Sheretz that swarms on the ground" (and is forbidden.)
(b) Question: If so, one should not drink beer in a vessel, lest a worm alighted on the vessel and returned to the beer!
(c) Answer: In that case, it is considered as if the worm never left the water (it is permitted.)
(d) Support (Beraisa): "You may eat anything in water" - this permits bending down to drink from pits (even though one may ingest worms.)
1. Question: We should be concerned, perhaps the worms alighted on the wall of the pit!
2. Answer: Since they never left the pit, they are permitted.
3. Similarly, if a worm in beer separated to the vessel wall, it is still permitted.
(e) (Rav Chisda): A Beraisa supports Rav Huna.
1. (Beraisa): "Every Sheretz that swarms on the ground" - this includes flies that were strained from wine.
2. Inference: Had they not been strained, they would be permitted.
(f) (Shmuel): If a gourd grew wormy while attached, the worms are forbidden - "Every Sheretz that swarms on the ground".
67b---------------------------------------67b

(g) Suggestion: An apparent contradiction of Beraisos supports Shmuel:
1. (Beraisa #1): "On the ground" - this excludes mites in lentils, chickpeas, dates and figs.
2. Contradiction (Beraisa #2): "Every Sheretz that swarms on the ground" - this includes worms in the roots of olives or vines.
3. Answer: Both Beraisos discuss mites in produce; in the former, they grew while the produce was attached; in the latter, they grew after it was detached.
(h) Rejection: No, in both Beraisos they grew when the produce was attached;
1. Beraisa #1 discusses mites (that started) in the produce; Beraisa #2 discusses mites of the tree itself.
2. Support: Beraisa #2 says 'worms in the roots of olive trees or vines'.
(i) Questions (Rav Yosef): If a worm separated and died immediately; or, if it entered the air (but never landed on the ground), what is the law?
(j) Questions (Rav Ashi): What is the law if a worm separated:
1. To the outside of the date; or, to the outside of the date pit; or, from one date to another?
(k) These questions are unresolved.
3) WORMS IN FISH
(a) Version #1 (Rav Sheshes brei d'Rav Idi): Worms in the lungs or liver (Rashi - of an animal; Tosfos - of a fish) are forbidden.
1. This is because they came from outside, i.e. they were ingested.
(b) Objection (Rav Ashi): If they were ingested, they would be found in the end of the digestive tract!
(c) Version #2 (Rav Sheshes brei d'Rav Idi): Worms in the lungs or liver are permitted.
1. This is because they grow from the animal (Tosfos - fish) itself.
(d) (Rav Ashi): This is obvious - if they were ingested, they would be found in the end of the digestive tract!
(e) The Halachah is, they are forbidden, because they enter through the respiratory system during sleep.
(f) Worms underneath the skin in animals are forbidden; in fish, they are permitted.
1. Ravina asked his mother to mix fish worms with his fish, so he would eat them without seeing them.
(g) Question (Rav Mesharshiya brei d'Rav Acha): What is the difference between worms in animals and worms in fish?
(h) Answer (Ravina): Animals (and worms inside) are forbidden until slaughtered; slaughter does not permit the worm;
1. Fish are permitted without slaughter, so worms that grow inside are also permitted.
(i) (Beraisa): "That goes on its belly" is a snake; "all" includes long worms; "four legs" refers to a scorpion; "all that goes" includes beetles; "many legs" is a centipede; "until every" - this includes similar species, and species similar to those.
(j) (Beraisa - R. Yosi Dormaskus): Livyason (a giant sea creature that Tzadikim will eat in the end of days) is a Tahor fish.
1. "Its protection" - these are its scales; "Under it are rays of sun" - these are its fins.

   
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